Saturday, July 31, 2010
Nancy Jane Finch
Could anyone help in finding Nancy Jane Finch (b 1896) born in Wigan? I have used the Free BMD which has no further information. Nancy Jane is the daughter of Richard Finch (1860-1934) and Nancy Jane (nee Howarth 1859-1917).
Friday, July 30, 2010
Information supplied
Thank you for the links for the "National Railway Museum" and for "Railway Ancestors" added on the front page. I hope to explore over the coming weeks with relation to Richard Finch. Much appreciated. We may find records relating to Richard and his life and times and employment on the Railway.
Once again thank you for this!
Once again thank you for this!
Monday, July 26, 2010
Mary Finch (1900-1973)
I have been spending time recently (a lot of time) on the children of Richard Finch and for some of them this has at times been a little speculative although I have received some very useful information from a member of the wider family. My thanks for that!
The problem comes with the daughters of Richard Finch as we always have to find the correct husband for daughters and Finch can be a ‘popular’name in Wigan and Standish and not all people called “Finch” are related to this Finch family. I became a little obsessed with Mary Finch (b 1900) and what happened to her but when did she die?
I was puzzled by a Mary Finch in the Burnley cemetery buried March 1 1973 (A12655). and wondered if this could be the daughter of Richard and Nancy Jane (nee Howarth). The aged certainly seemed correct although it takes a little more than a ‘blunt’ age to ascribe parentage. There was a need to cross reference the occupant of the grave to the family to make a positive match but how to do that.
The grave number (A12655) seemed the best way to do that and thanks to the OPC project, I was able to look at the grave number for Mary Finch and cross reference that against other members of the family in Burnley. That seems to have done the trick because the other occupant is none other that Nancy Jane herself buried December 8 1917 in grave A12655. It seems that either other people had suggested- post mortem-that Mary may be buried with her own mother or Mary may have made a stipulation that she be buried with her own mother.
Is this attribution co-incidence? Well, yes it could be and I have to offer that as a possibility in the absence of documentary evidence and being at a distance but it is perhaps a little churlish to deny that the Mary Finch buried in 1973 is not the daughter of Nancy Jane. The idea of Mary being buried in the same grave as her mother seems right and proper and an idea that we should nurture rather than discount.
So, Mary Finch is accounted for and ‘gathered in’ and we know what happened to her and Mary and Nancy Jane Finch are buried alongside Rose Lilian Finch who died in 1920. The same is not true of Mary’s sister - Nancy Jane Finch – and we will have to work to find her resting place as she is not in the cemetery at Burnley.
The problem comes with the daughters of Richard Finch as we always have to find the correct husband for daughters and Finch can be a ‘popular’name in Wigan and Standish and not all people called “Finch” are related to this Finch family. I became a little obsessed with Mary Finch (b 1900) and what happened to her but when did she die?
I was puzzled by a Mary Finch in the Burnley cemetery buried March 1 1973 (A12655). and wondered if this could be the daughter of Richard and Nancy Jane (nee Howarth). The aged certainly seemed correct although it takes a little more than a ‘blunt’ age to ascribe parentage. There was a need to cross reference the occupant of the grave to the family to make a positive match but how to do that.
The grave number (A12655) seemed the best way to do that and thanks to the OPC project, I was able to look at the grave number for Mary Finch and cross reference that against other members of the family in Burnley. That seems to have done the trick because the other occupant is none other that Nancy Jane herself buried December 8 1917 in grave A12655. It seems that either other people had suggested- post mortem-that Mary may be buried with her own mother or Mary may have made a stipulation that she be buried with her own mother.
Is this attribution co-incidence? Well, yes it could be and I have to offer that as a possibility in the absence of documentary evidence and being at a distance but it is perhaps a little churlish to deny that the Mary Finch buried in 1973 is not the daughter of Nancy Jane. The idea of Mary being buried in the same grave as her mother seems right and proper and an idea that we should nurture rather than discount.
So, Mary Finch is accounted for and ‘gathered in’ and we know what happened to her and Mary and Nancy Jane Finch are buried alongside Rose Lilian Finch who died in 1920. The same is not true of Mary’s sister - Nancy Jane Finch – and we will have to work to find her resting place as she is not in the cemetery at Burnley.
William Finch (1894-1964)
26 Lower Water St
Deveneley
204024
The First World War records for William Finch are quite hard to find. The address above gives no indication that Lower Water Street is in fact in Burnley and is not in the fictitious town created in error. I disregarded this record for some weeks until I looked at this William Finch in "Deveneley" and found that it was correct.
The address at enlistment is given as 421, Warrington Road, Lower Ince, Wigan. However, Warrington Road is soon crossed out and replaced by Lower Water Street the home that saw the death of William's son Harold in 1917. The occupation of William Finch at enlistment is given as haulage hand and later as a motor driver. This designation indicates that at least the early part life William Finch had escaped the family tradition of being a coal miner although he would later go back to that occupation.
At enlistment William was 22 years 11 months old. However the more remarkable statistics come about when we start to see comments made about the physical state of William who was, by modern standards, a person of diminutive build. William's height is recorded at 5'2" which is, by modern standards, quite short. However the diminutive height is matched by a diminutive weight and William's weight is recorded as 122llb which makes him around 9 stones in all. The examining officer found that William's chest was 35 inches when expanded with a 3 inch range of expansion.A scar below the right and eye was present. In terms of physical state; this is recorded as "good" and William is seen to have brown hair, brown eyes and a dark complexion.
In terms of war record there is little to go on. The documents that are available are difficult to read in electronic form and may not be that revealing in a hard copy format. William is seen to have been awarded the British War Medal and see Victory Medal although this seems to have been fairly standard for most servicemen.
Despite a undistinguished war record, William was wounded March 29 1918 and appears to have been transferred to a hospital in Newcastle upon Tyne in England and it seems that he stayed there until June 2, 1918 when he was granted a one week furlough ending June 11 1918. We presume that he went home to his wife and family.
William was seen as being fit for duty to the "command depot" although not fit for "duty" or "employment" as the other options. This outcome indicates that William's injuries although perhaps not life threatening were certainly serious enough to warrant hospitalisation and being invalided out of the immediate battle zone and quite a protracted period of convalescence.
http://finchgenealogy.blogspot.com/
Deveneley
204024
The First World War records for William Finch are quite hard to find. The address above gives no indication that Lower Water Street is in fact in Burnley and is not in the fictitious town created in error. I disregarded this record for some weeks until I looked at this William Finch in "Deveneley" and found that it was correct.
The address at enlistment is given as 421, Warrington Road, Lower Ince, Wigan. However, Warrington Road is soon crossed out and replaced by Lower Water Street the home that saw the death of William's son Harold in 1917. The occupation of William Finch at enlistment is given as haulage hand and later as a motor driver. This designation indicates that at least the early part life William Finch had escaped the family tradition of being a coal miner although he would later go back to that occupation.
At enlistment William was 22 years 11 months old. However the more remarkable statistics come about when we start to see comments made about the physical state of William who was, by modern standards, a person of diminutive build. William's height is recorded at 5'2" which is, by modern standards, quite short. However the diminutive height is matched by a diminutive weight and William's weight is recorded as 122llb which makes him around 9 stones in all. The examining officer found that William's chest was 35 inches when expanded with a 3 inch range of expansion.A scar below the right and eye was present. In terms of physical state; this is recorded as "good" and William is seen to have brown hair, brown eyes and a dark complexion.
In terms of war record there is little to go on. The documents that are available are difficult to read in electronic form and may not be that revealing in a hard copy format. William is seen to have been awarded the British War Medal and see Victory Medal although this seems to have been fairly standard for most servicemen.
Despite a undistinguished war record, William was wounded March 29 1918 and appears to have been transferred to a hospital in Newcastle upon Tyne in England and it seems that he stayed there until June 2, 1918 when he was granted a one week furlough ending June 11 1918. We presume that he went home to his wife and family.
William was seen as being fit for duty to the "command depot" although not fit for "duty" or "employment" as the other options. This outcome indicates that William's injuries although perhaps not life threatening were certainly serious enough to warrant hospitalisation and being invalided out of the immediate battle zone and quite a protracted period of convalescence.
http://finchgenealogy.blogspot.com/
Sunday, July 25, 2010
Second marriages
Many marriages in Victorian England involved at least one person who has been married before. The Marriage of William Finch (1835-1912) to Rachel Murray (nee Hilton) evidences and witnesses this tendency. Many of these second marriages included children from a previous relationship as did the marriage of William and Rachel who had a joint child (Edwin Finch b 1877) to join their existing children. We can also see the second marriage of William’s son, Richard Finch and Ellen Adams and their second family.See this link for background reading
A second marriage may have been based on financial necessity and child care needs rather than what the 21st Century may see as a ‘love match’ Starting a new life together may have been seen as exciting as in any culture and it presented other relationship for parents and children alike. In the household there were doubtless many ‘step’ relationships.
William and Rachel will have been aware of the problems of a second marriage and aware of the benefits from such second marriages and the families they created. William may have found it advantageous to have a mother to his 5 children and Rachel to have a man around to support her in the care of her 8 previous children. However, the household must have been overcrowded.
William and Rachel will need to have come to terms with emotions following the death of Rachel’s first husband James Murray (1832-1873) (married on December 5, 1851, Pemberton) who appears to have died in the Workhouse and the death of Elizabeth Gaskill. They will have needed to learn to live in a stepfamily and manage change.
A second marriage may have been based on financial necessity and child care needs rather than what the 21st Century may see as a ‘love match’ Starting a new life together may have been seen as exciting as in any culture and it presented other relationship for parents and children alike. In the household there were doubtless many ‘step’ relationships.
William and Rachel will have been aware of the problems of a second marriage and aware of the benefits from such second marriages and the families they created. William may have found it advantageous to have a mother to his 5 children and Rachel to have a man around to support her in the care of her 8 previous children. However, the household must have been overcrowded.
William and Rachel will need to have come to terms with emotions following the death of Rachel’s first husband James Murray (1832-1873) (married on December 5, 1851, Pemberton) who appears to have died in the Workhouse and the death of Elizabeth Gaskill. They will have needed to learn to live in a stepfamily and manage change.
Friday, July 23, 2010
"Burnley Express". 8th December 1917
Does anyone have access to the "Burnley Express" newspaper for this date as I'd be very grateful for the obituary (if it exists) for Nancy Jane Finch. Nancy Jane Finch (nee Howarth),(1859-1917), died prematurely aged 58 and was buried in the Burnley Cemetery (Grave: A12655) on 8th December 1917.I would really like to have the information contained if at all possible.
Richard Finch (1860-September 15 1934)
In the recent history of the Finch family, Richard Finch is possibly one on the easier people to research and the person with the best documented life as reflected in the public record. Richard's later life also creates some minor mysteries.
The life of Richard Finch as reflected in the publically accessible records also reflects some of the potential pitfalls of genealogy. There is a need to reconcile the accounts of the record with the oral accounts of family members. One problem in researching Richard Finch is that no living relative (as at 1982) was able to say, with certainty, where Richard Finch had died and under what circumstances and where he was buried. This is significant because the same people were often able to give accurate accounts relating to long deceased ancestors and yet the death of their own grandfather caused them some puzzlement. In effect, we are left with the idea that Richard Finch slipped out of his family's knowledge and understanding and that there may have been a rift of some description between him and his own children but more on that later.
In understanding the life of Richard we should remember that his father, William Finch, was an uneducated collier who was unable to sign his name on the marriage documentation and, instead, made his mark as did his wife, Elizabeth Gaskill. Richards mother is recorded as being a "factory hand" at the time of her marriage to William with her own father's occupation being recorded as a "Carter". Richard had no background of privilege or education and he suffered the loss of his mother in 1873 where he was 13 years old.
Richard's early life witnesses his birth in Standish on March 15, 1860 before moving between 135, Ormskirk Road, Pemberton, Ince in makerfield and Wigan settling at Turner Street in Wigan where he married Nancy Jane Howarth on July 1, 1883. Richard was able to sign his own name on the marriage documentation although Nancy Jane made her mark. Interestingly, the witnesses to the wedding were Edward Priest and Elizabeth Ann Howarth. Richard Finch and Nancy Jane would reciprocate as witnesses at the wedding of Edward and Elizabeth Ann shortly afterwards. The marriage of Richard Finch and Nancy Jane Howarth took place at St Georges Church in Wigan.
The marriage certificate of 1883 clearly indicates that the father of Richard Finch is William Finch who was a collier and the father of Nancy Jane Howarth, Israel Howarth, also a collier. The occupation of Richard at the time of his marriage is giving as an engine cleaner and the long term progression of Richard from engine cleaner to subsequent engine driver is seen to commence.
There has always been speculation when researching Richards life as to the exact point that Richard made the move between his life in Wigan and his life in Burnley. We can see a Richard Finch, engine driver, first listed in the Wigan Electoral Roll and Burgesses List for 1889-1890. The qualifying properties for this registration being 4 Robinson Square and 9 Hey Street and it has always been thought that Richard occupied Hey Street. In the list for 1890-1891 and subsequent lists, Hey Street is the sole qualifying property. The last electoral roll in which Richard Finch appears in Wigan is that for 1900-1901. However, The 20th Century Directory of Wigan mentions Richard Finch as still living at Hey street in 1903. This is the latest reference of Richard in Wigan that can be found. Regrettably the property at Hey Street has since been demolished and is not available to view
Following the departure from Wigan, Richard does appear to have moved to Burnley and we find him living at 10, Woodsley Street between 1902 and 1920. The property at 10 Woodsley Street, Burnley, no longer exists and is probably part on the land purchased for the M65 motorway
In effect, we see Richard at one point owning properties in Wigan and Burnley before disposing of the property in Wigan and settling entirely in Burnley. Property ownership is particularly significant in the life of Richard if we remember that Richard's own father, William appears to have died in the Wigan Union Workhouse in 1912. Whatever the position of Richard in relation to property ownership it clearly did not incline Richard to provide any form of obvious care and support to his own father.
Richard Finch of 10 Woodsley Street, Burnley, also appears in the Register of Parochial Electors from 1908 to 1915 and in the registers of 1919 and 1920. Richard Finch, junior, and Richard Finch, senior, are both listed. It is also possible that Richard Finch was partly living in Burnley before 1902 as the Barrett's directories do not contain Compleat list of residence of the town.
We can be confident that this Richard Finch is the Richard Finch in question in that "Finch" is not a Burnley surname; this is clearly revealed by the compleat absence of any families of this name in the 1851 and 1871 census returns for Burnley. In the modern telephone directory for the East Lancs area the name is almost entirely concentrated in the Blackburn and Bolton areas unlike other names which are entirely found in North East Lancashire district. We can also witness that the Finch Burials in the Burnley Cemetery are all related to Richard Finch with no Finch burials before the family settled in Burnley.
Richard and Nancy Jane seemed to be fairly settled in Burnley from around 1904 up until the premature death on Nancy Jane in 1917. It is after 1917 that we perhaps see one of the less well documented features of Richard's life and that may be a second marriage in 1920 at the age of 60 years old to Ellen Adams. At the time of writing, this marriage is conjectural and we rely upon the electronic record rather than by corroboration of hard copy evidence. However, something apparently happened in 1920 as it is the last time that Richard Finch appears in the records of Burnley and after a possible marriage with Ellen.
1920 also seemed to be period when the children of Richard and Nancy start to drift away from Burnley and form their own households. The Free BMD does show that a Richard Finch married a woman known as 'Adams' and had two children in the Bristol area one of whom survived to majority. This record also shows a Richard Finch who could have been born in the 1860 having died in Thornbury, Gloucestershire, England. The interesting point is that Bristol and Thornbury are quite close geographically and the dividing line is sometimes one that causes confusion to genealogists. These facts are not evidential although they are persuasive of a second family for Richard.
The final burial place of Richard is not known although the online records for Thornbury have been searched without success and it may be that Richard's ultimate burial place is in the Bristol area although this remains to be confirmed.
Richards life contains a number of interesting features and there is no doubt that he achieved a deal of property ownership and financial security not seen in the lives of other family members of that same period. He seems to have declined to financially support his own father and seems to have remarried later in life before leaving the geographical area and settling in Gloucestershire and starting his second family. I am fairly sure that Richard will have left some form of legacy to his descendants and a review of a will or letters of administration may reveal more about the second family.
The life of Richard Finch as reflected in the publically accessible records also reflects some of the potential pitfalls of genealogy. There is a need to reconcile the accounts of the record with the oral accounts of family members. One problem in researching Richard Finch is that no living relative (as at 1982) was able to say, with certainty, where Richard Finch had died and under what circumstances and where he was buried. This is significant because the same people were often able to give accurate accounts relating to long deceased ancestors and yet the death of their own grandfather caused them some puzzlement. In effect, we are left with the idea that Richard Finch slipped out of his family's knowledge and understanding and that there may have been a rift of some description between him and his own children but more on that later.
In understanding the life of Richard we should remember that his father, William Finch, was an uneducated collier who was unable to sign his name on the marriage documentation and, instead, made his mark as did his wife, Elizabeth Gaskill. Richards mother is recorded as being a "factory hand" at the time of her marriage to William with her own father's occupation being recorded as a "Carter". Richard had no background of privilege or education and he suffered the loss of his mother in 1873 where he was 13 years old.
Richard's early life witnesses his birth in Standish on March 15, 1860 before moving between 135, Ormskirk Road, Pemberton, Ince in makerfield and Wigan settling at Turner Street in Wigan where he married Nancy Jane Howarth on July 1, 1883. Richard was able to sign his own name on the marriage documentation although Nancy Jane made her mark. Interestingly, the witnesses to the wedding were Edward Priest and Elizabeth Ann Howarth. Richard Finch and Nancy Jane would reciprocate as witnesses at the wedding of Edward and Elizabeth Ann shortly afterwards. The marriage of Richard Finch and Nancy Jane Howarth took place at St Georges Church in Wigan.
The marriage certificate of 1883 clearly indicates that the father of Richard Finch is William Finch who was a collier and the father of Nancy Jane Howarth, Israel Howarth, also a collier. The occupation of Richard at the time of his marriage is giving as an engine cleaner and the long term progression of Richard from engine cleaner to subsequent engine driver is seen to commence.
There has always been speculation when researching Richards life as to the exact point that Richard made the move between his life in Wigan and his life in Burnley. We can see a Richard Finch, engine driver, first listed in the Wigan Electoral Roll and Burgesses List for 1889-1890. The qualifying properties for this registration being 4 Robinson Square and 9 Hey Street and it has always been thought that Richard occupied Hey Street. In the list for 1890-1891 and subsequent lists, Hey Street is the sole qualifying property. The last electoral roll in which Richard Finch appears in Wigan is that for 1900-1901. However, The 20th Century Directory of Wigan mentions Richard Finch as still living at Hey street in 1903. This is the latest reference of Richard in Wigan that can be found. Regrettably the property at Hey Street has since been demolished and is not available to view
Following the departure from Wigan, Richard does appear to have moved to Burnley and we find him living at 10, Woodsley Street between 1902 and 1920. The property at 10 Woodsley Street, Burnley, no longer exists and is probably part on the land purchased for the M65 motorway
In effect, we see Richard at one point owning properties in Wigan and Burnley before disposing of the property in Wigan and settling entirely in Burnley. Property ownership is particularly significant in the life of Richard if we remember that Richard's own father, William appears to have died in the Wigan Union Workhouse in 1912. Whatever the position of Richard in relation to property ownership it clearly did not incline Richard to provide any form of obvious care and support to his own father.
Richard Finch of 10 Woodsley Street, Burnley, also appears in the Register of Parochial Electors from 1908 to 1915 and in the registers of 1919 and 1920. Richard Finch, junior, and Richard Finch, senior, are both listed. It is also possible that Richard Finch was partly living in Burnley before 1902 as the Barrett's directories do not contain Compleat list of residence of the town.
We can be confident that this Richard Finch is the Richard Finch in question in that "Finch" is not a Burnley surname; this is clearly revealed by the compleat absence of any families of this name in the 1851 and 1871 census returns for Burnley. In the modern telephone directory for the East Lancs area the name is almost entirely concentrated in the Blackburn and Bolton areas unlike other names which are entirely found in North East Lancashire district. We can also witness that the Finch Burials in the Burnley Cemetery are all related to Richard Finch with no Finch burials before the family settled in Burnley.
Richard and Nancy Jane seemed to be fairly settled in Burnley from around 1904 up until the premature death on Nancy Jane in 1917. It is after 1917 that we perhaps see one of the less well documented features of Richard's life and that may be a second marriage in 1920 at the age of 60 years old to Ellen Adams. At the time of writing, this marriage is conjectural and we rely upon the electronic record rather than by corroboration of hard copy evidence. However, something apparently happened in 1920 as it is the last time that Richard Finch appears in the records of Burnley and after a possible marriage with Ellen.
1920 also seemed to be period when the children of Richard and Nancy start to drift away from Burnley and form their own households. The Free BMD does show that a Richard Finch married a woman known as 'Adams' and had two children in the Bristol area one of whom survived to majority. This record also shows a Richard Finch who could have been born in the 1860 having died in Thornbury, Gloucestershire, England. The interesting point is that Bristol and Thornbury are quite close geographically and the dividing line is sometimes one that causes confusion to genealogists. These facts are not evidential although they are persuasive of a second family for Richard.
The final burial place of Richard is not known although the online records for Thornbury have been searched without success and it may be that Richard's ultimate burial place is in the Bristol area although this remains to be confirmed.
Richards life contains a number of interesting features and there is no doubt that he achieved a deal of property ownership and financial security not seen in the lives of other family members of that same period. He seems to have declined to financially support his own father and seems to have remarried later in life before leaving the geographical area and settling in Gloucestershire and starting his second family. I am fairly sure that Richard will have left some form of legacy to his descendants and a review of a will or letters of administration may reveal more about the second family.
William Finch (Born abt 1774) - A weaver of Lancaster
To be frank: the search for remote ancestors can be a little bit of a gamble and some people take what the British call ‘a punt’ on the likely ancestors, that is, they randomly choose from a range of likely options. I am sure that some ‘punts’ or ‘guesses’ are likely to succeed and some choices are far more convincing than others. Less satisfactory are the choices made from a range of ancestors likely to provide a link to a famous person or a ‘desirable’ relative. This can be seen as ‘family tree surgery’ where we unintentionally remove, or add, branches that are desirable
When researching from the digital record and with no immediate ability to check the paper record, I came across the problem of John Finch and the parentage of John Finch (1804-1846). There are a number of people called John Finch in both Wigan and Standish in the period and this brings the research to a halt in many ways. Just how do we decide on the most likely option from the digital sources available? Which is the correct Finch and in what period?
The issue of the correct Finch and how to take the research backwards in time is amplified by the rendering of the name for the wife of William Finch married on June 2 1794 at St Mary’s Church in Lancaster, Lancashire, England. William Finch as a name is easy enough and he is identified as a weaver of Lancaster and he marries Jane Kissack a spinster of Lancaster. However, a problem occurs with Jane’s maiden name which is variously rendered as ‘Gueswick’, ‘Keswick’, ‘Heswick’ and possibly even ‘Keathwick’ for the birth of her children although if we search and cross compare against different digital records we can make a ‘choice’ of Jane Kissack as the most likely mother for John and the wife of William. Have a look at the IGI and other records to see the many options and possibilities for the spellings.
At this point we are somewhat left lacking further information as the online record goes cold and we cannot further refine our knowledge of William Finch. However, William Finch is a weaver and the idea of a weaver from Lancaster coming to Standish in the early 19th Century seems quite reasonable. In effect, William was leaving what may have been a quiet rural backwater and heading for a centre of hand weaving that was increasingly to turn into a centre of power looms and mechanisation. Wiliam was taking his new wife to a centre where their skills could benefit them most. This is speculation although perhaps not unreasonable
Try this page for a debate on weaving and Wigan/Standish(http://www.wiganman.co.uk/Content/history/hand_weavers-1.html)
It does mean that this part of the Finch family present in Standish and Wigan may not always be seen as Wigan/Standish family and perhaps should be seen as a Lancaster family. The link with William and Jane also opens up the possibility for a link to the Isle of Man as ‘Kissack’ is a name that originates on the island. Place ‘Kissack’ into Google and see what happens. Unfortuantely, I cannot see a way of taking this forward and we may have to accept this link as speculative although possible.
In essence, the link to William Finch and Lancaster is speculative at the moment and we need to confirm or refute the link.
When researching from the digital record and with no immediate ability to check the paper record, I came across the problem of John Finch and the parentage of John Finch (1804-1846). There are a number of people called John Finch in both Wigan and Standish in the period and this brings the research to a halt in many ways. Just how do we decide on the most likely option from the digital sources available? Which is the correct Finch and in what period?
The issue of the correct Finch and how to take the research backwards in time is amplified by the rendering of the name for the wife of William Finch married on June 2 1794 at St Mary’s Church in Lancaster, Lancashire, England. William Finch as a name is easy enough and he is identified as a weaver of Lancaster and he marries Jane Kissack a spinster of Lancaster. However, a problem occurs with Jane’s maiden name which is variously rendered as ‘Gueswick’, ‘Keswick’, ‘Heswick’ and possibly even ‘Keathwick’ for the birth of her children although if we search and cross compare against different digital records we can make a ‘choice’ of Jane Kissack as the most likely mother for John and the wife of William. Have a look at the IGI and other records to see the many options and possibilities for the spellings.
At this point we are somewhat left lacking further information as the online record goes cold and we cannot further refine our knowledge of William Finch. However, William Finch is a weaver and the idea of a weaver from Lancaster coming to Standish in the early 19th Century seems quite reasonable. In effect, William was leaving what may have been a quiet rural backwater and heading for a centre of hand weaving that was increasingly to turn into a centre of power looms and mechanisation. Wiliam was taking his new wife to a centre where their skills could benefit them most. This is speculation although perhaps not unreasonable
Try this page for a debate on weaving and Wigan/Standish(http://www.wiganman.co.uk/Content/history/hand_weavers-1.html)
It does mean that this part of the Finch family present in Standish and Wigan may not always be seen as Wigan/Standish family and perhaps should be seen as a Lancaster family. The link with William and Jane also opens up the possibility for a link to the Isle of Man as ‘Kissack’ is a name that originates on the island. Place ‘Kissack’ into Google and see what happens. Unfortuantely, I cannot see a way of taking this forward and we may have to accept this link as speculative although possible.
In essence, the link to William Finch and Lancaster is speculative at the moment and we need to confirm or refute the link.
Thursday, July 22, 2010
Richard Finch (1860-1934)
There has been some debate surrounding the parents of Richard Finch. Some say that Richard's parents are 'Heneage and Jane' and others say 'William and Elizabeth and this debate is to be expected as we search the information available to us.
The problem seems to be based on the reliance that researchers place on digital genealogy and the comparative importance placed on the paper trail. The main issue seems to be that we do not simply rely on the digital trail and that we check the paper trail from time to time. It is also fair to say that the digital trail is quicker and easier than the paper trail and a lot more fun in some ways.
When I began to search the family history in 1982, I had the paper trail delivered in one go in the form of 'hard copy' certificates. Although this resource was expensive it was also informative. I learnt a lot and I have had time to speak to relatives (now deceased) and to assimilate the information provided.
I can comfirm that the parents of Richard Finch are in fact 'William and Elizabeth' rather then 'Heneage' and that this is confirmed in the marriage certificate of Richard Finch where the father of the groom is stated to be William and to be a collier.
The importance of the paper trail seems to be manifest.
The problem seems to be based on the reliance that researchers place on digital genealogy and the comparative importance placed on the paper trail. The main issue seems to be that we do not simply rely on the digital trail and that we check the paper trail from time to time. It is also fair to say that the digital trail is quicker and easier than the paper trail and a lot more fun in some ways.
When I began to search the family history in 1982, I had the paper trail delivered in one go in the form of 'hard copy' certificates. Although this resource was expensive it was also informative. I learnt a lot and I have had time to speak to relatives (now deceased) and to assimilate the information provided.
I can comfirm that the parents of Richard Finch are in fact 'William and Elizabeth' rather then 'Heneage' and that this is confirmed in the marriage certificate of Richard Finch where the father of the groom is stated to be William and to be a collier.
The importance of the paper trail seems to be manifest.
The 'Fitch Cross'.
The badge comprised of the fitch cross is a device and no more than that. The family did not hold the right to have a coat of arms and was not 'armigerous'. We did not have the trappings of aristocracy but more about that at a later date.
The badge is based on a ‘fitch’ cross with the fitch being the sharpened point at the base. The choice of ‘fitch’ is a pun in the same way that the “Wiggin Tree” is a pun on ‘Wigan’.
Aristocratic origins are not evident for the ancestors although we can celebrate their very real origins whilst also allowing them the same dignity that other genealogies afford their own ancestors.
I would really like the different Finch families from Lancashire to use the 'fitch cross' as a symbol of our often shared ancestry.
The badge is based on a ‘fitch’ cross with the fitch being the sharpened point at the base. The choice of ‘fitch’ is a pun in the same way that the “Wiggin Tree” is a pun on ‘Wigan’.
Aristocratic origins are not evident for the ancestors although we can celebrate their very real origins whilst also allowing them the same dignity that other genealogies afford their own ancestors.
I would really like the different Finch families from Lancashire to use the 'fitch cross' as a symbol of our often shared ancestry.
Parish records Wigan
The online records for All Saints in Wigan read like a who’s who of the ancestors with ‘Finch’ being a numerically prominent family in the town in the late 18th and early 19th Centuries.
http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Wigan/Wigan/allsaints/index.html
In this series of records we have a wider series of occupations than those based in primary or extractive industry although the general theme of industrial occupations is reinforced.
• John Finch is a goldsmith buried in 1783
• William Finch is a bookseller buried in 1798
• Robert Finch is a tailor buried in 1811
• Robert Finch is a Pewterer buried in 1812
• Alice Finch is a ‘huckster’ buried in 1810
• Thomas Finch is a pauper buried in 1830
Women are seen to die in ‘childbed’ which is to be expected in a period of poor/none existent ante-natal care and poverty is seen in the life of Alice who makes her living as a huckster …..
Huckster: “One who sells wares or provisions in the street; a peddler or hawker or One who uses aggressive, showy, and sometimes devious methods to promote or sell a product.”
We also have Thomas who was a child in the workshouse dying at the age of 3.
In Wigan we may perceive the workings of the larger town and the more complex relationships between people and the ways in which they earn a living.
http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Wigan/Wigan/allsaints/index.html
In this series of records we have a wider series of occupations than those based in primary or extractive industry although the general theme of industrial occupations is reinforced.
• John Finch is a goldsmith buried in 1783
• William Finch is a bookseller buried in 1798
• Robert Finch is a tailor buried in 1811
• Robert Finch is a Pewterer buried in 1812
• Alice Finch is a ‘huckster’ buried in 1810
• Thomas Finch is a pauper buried in 1830
Women are seen to die in ‘childbed’ which is to be expected in a period of poor/none existent ante-natal care and poverty is seen in the life of Alice who makes her living as a huckster …..
Huckster: “One who sells wares or provisions in the street; a peddler or hawker or One who uses aggressive, showy, and sometimes devious methods to promote or sell a product.”
We also have Thomas who was a child in the workshouse dying at the age of 3.
In Wigan we may perceive the workings of the larger town and the more complex relationships between people and the ways in which they earn a living.
1841 Census and Wigan
1841 Census Wigan
http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Wigan/index.html
This census is harder to read as it hasn’t been divided into sections or sub-divided. However, it still proves useful in gaining an impression of the ancestors in Wigan, their socio-economic status and prospects.
However, it is clear that the numbers of ancestors are slightly lower in Wigan although Wigan is numerically larger than nearby Standish.
Some of the occupations of the ancestors in Wigan include.
• John Finch. Innkeeper
• Peter Finch. Nailor
• Elizabeth Finch. Cotton Spinner
• Martin Finch. Plumber and Glazier
• William Finch. Tailor
• Ann Finch. Pauper.
• Henry Finch. Pipemaker
• John Finch. Rope maker
The ancestors in Wigan appear to have more varied occupations than those of Standish although they are based on secondary manufacturing industry such as a nail making and rope making rather than primary or extractive industry such as a coal mining.
The one pauper appears in Wigan although there are no explanations for the pauperism which may be related to disability or widowhood.
http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Wigan/index.html
This census is harder to read as it hasn’t been divided into sections or sub-divided. However, it still proves useful in gaining an impression of the ancestors in Wigan, their socio-economic status and prospects.
However, it is clear that the numbers of ancestors are slightly lower in Wigan although Wigan is numerically larger than nearby Standish.
Some of the occupations of the ancestors in Wigan include.
• John Finch. Innkeeper
• Peter Finch. Nailor
• Elizabeth Finch. Cotton Spinner
• Martin Finch. Plumber and Glazier
• William Finch. Tailor
• Ann Finch. Pauper.
• Henry Finch. Pipemaker
• John Finch. Rope maker
The ancestors in Wigan appear to have more varied occupations than those of Standish although they are based on secondary manufacturing industry such as a nail making and rope making rather than primary or extractive industry such as a coal mining.
The one pauper appears in Wigan although there are no explanations for the pauperism which may be related to disability or widowhood.
'Industrial peasantry'
The Finch family present in Standish and Wigan is large in numbers and can be traced to the 17th Century although the family has been poorly researched so far.
The large numbers of ancestors in the churchyard of Standish and Wigan is a testament to the strong and robust family presence in the geographical area although there is little ‘presence’ for the family.
Have a look at this site for Standish parish records http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Standish/StWilfrids/index.html and see the sheer numbers of ancestors to research over a long period of time. There is no doubt that Standish (and Wigan) are the home of this surname in the North of England. However, when we compare the two Census returns in 1841 they indicate that the name is more prevalent in Standish?
By the idea of presence I mean the usual artefacts left behind by the family. There are few documents, wills, tombstones or monuments in Churches. If the ancestors collectively left monuments to themselves then those monuments are in the ephemera of the County archive rather than in marble and stone.
As a family we seem to have been financially poor and with little material security. William Finch 1835-1912 died as an inmate of the Wigan Union Workhouse and the Howarth’s who married into the family in 1883 had their own financial problems.
A brief survey of the occupations for the family buried in Standish and Wigan indicate what may be described as ‘industrial peasantry’ rather than the middle classes or ‘shire family’ and this seems to be the reason for the paucity of records. Poor people leave little material evidence of their passing!
The generations seem to contain ‘colliers’ and ‘factory-hands’ whilst having its fair share of early deaths based on ill health. We do not have the professions in the family and we did not have land
The large numbers of ancestors in the churchyard of Standish and Wigan is a testament to the strong and robust family presence in the geographical area although there is little ‘presence’ for the family.
Have a look at this site for Standish parish records http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Standish/StWilfrids/index.html and see the sheer numbers of ancestors to research over a long period of time. There is no doubt that Standish (and Wigan) are the home of this surname in the North of England. However, when we compare the two Census returns in 1841 they indicate that the name is more prevalent in Standish?
By the idea of presence I mean the usual artefacts left behind by the family. There are few documents, wills, tombstones or monuments in Churches. If the ancestors collectively left monuments to themselves then those monuments are in the ephemera of the County archive rather than in marble and stone.
As a family we seem to have been financially poor and with little material security. William Finch 1835-1912 died as an inmate of the Wigan Union Workhouse and the Howarth’s who married into the family in 1883 had their own financial problems.
A brief survey of the occupations for the family buried in Standish and Wigan indicate what may be described as ‘industrial peasantry’ rather than the middle classes or ‘shire family’ and this seems to be the reason for the paucity of records. Poor people leave little material evidence of their passing!
The generations seem to contain ‘colliers’ and ‘factory-hands’ whilst having its fair share of early deaths based on ill health. We do not have the professions in the family and we did not have land
1841 Census and Standish
1841 Census of Standish and what is tells the researcher
http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Standish/index.html
This on line census is magnificent in that it is divided alphabetically and easy to access. It indicates the sheer number of ancestors and this number is significantly larger then nearby Wigan. Standish is clearly the home of the Finch family in the North West of England.
The census also indicates the industrial nature of employment for the ancestors
The census lists the following occupations for some heads of family. Some families contained a variety of occupations and one branch of the family contained Betty Finch who at the age of 15 worked in a coal mine.
• John Finch Stonemason
• James Finch. Coal labourer
• William Finch. Nail Maker
• Enage Finch. Cotton Weaver
• James Finch. Agricultural Labourer
• William Finch. Coal Miner
• John Finch. Coal Miner
• Richard Finch. Coal Miner
• James Finch. Nailor
• Edward Finch. Nailor
• William Finch. Agricultural labourer.
This survey is not exhaustive as there are other family members on the census not included in this list. However, it does indicate that the ancestors were not from the professional class and were probably uneducated and poor although no more so than the other residents of Standish.
http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Standish/index.html
This on line census is magnificent in that it is divided alphabetically and easy to access. It indicates the sheer number of ancestors and this number is significantly larger then nearby Wigan. Standish is clearly the home of the Finch family in the North West of England.
The census also indicates the industrial nature of employment for the ancestors
The census lists the following occupations for some heads of family. Some families contained a variety of occupations and one branch of the family contained Betty Finch who at the age of 15 worked in a coal mine.
• John Finch Stonemason
• James Finch. Coal labourer
• William Finch. Nail Maker
• Enage Finch. Cotton Weaver
• James Finch. Agricultural Labourer
• William Finch. Coal Miner
• John Finch. Coal Miner
• Richard Finch. Coal Miner
• James Finch. Nailor
• Edward Finch. Nailor
• William Finch. Agricultural labourer.
This survey is not exhaustive as there are other family members on the census not included in this list. However, it does indicate that the ancestors were not from the professional class and were probably uneducated and poor although no more so than the other residents of Standish.
Richard Finch (1860-1934)
Richard Finch (1860-1934) is a little bit of an enigma in that he disappears from the family in Burnley after the death of Nancy Jane Finch in 1917.
My older relative who oftens acts as an informant in these matters seems to have forgotten where Richard died. Despite a vague recollection of a death on Gloucestershire. Now, this is a little odd becasue Richard had no apparent links with the South West of England unless those links were formed resulting from employment on the railways. The links with the South-West may also have come from a second wife. A second wife may also account for the disappearance from the family and a certain ambiguity surrounding his death. My hunch is "Ellen Adams" who married a Richard Finch in Burnley although the story grows....
An 'Adams' woman has two children by a Richard Finch in Bristol before Richard's death in Thornbury and it seems unlikely to see this as based on simple coincidence. The interesting feature of the two births is that 'Thornbury' seen as the possible place of death of 'our' Richard Finch is very close to Bristol which sees the birth of two Finch children.
This needs to be investigated further. I add this story here and would appreciate any information or advice about a second marriage
My older relative who oftens acts as an informant in these matters seems to have forgotten where Richard died. Despite a vague recollection of a death on Gloucestershire. Now, this is a little odd becasue Richard had no apparent links with the South West of England unless those links were formed resulting from employment on the railways. The links with the South-West may also have come from a second wife. A second wife may also account for the disappearance from the family and a certain ambiguity surrounding his death. My hunch is "Ellen Adams" who married a Richard Finch in Burnley although the story grows....
An 'Adams' woman has two children by a Richard Finch in Bristol before Richard's death in Thornbury and it seems unlikely to see this as based on simple coincidence. The interesting feature of the two births is that 'Thornbury' seen as the possible place of death of 'our' Richard Finch is very close to Bristol which sees the birth of two Finch children.
This needs to be investigated further. I add this story here and would appreciate any information or advice about a second marriage
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